I Don't Know What to Say

[Richard OFfill]

We often must listen to the sound of

[Carl]

Full scale progressiveness underway it sounds where their motto is, "if it doesn't sound like the world, it's not cool" or, "mama, I want to be like the world". The worst part is, SDA's who should know better are instead helping this evil along and reveling in it.

Yes! Jesus IS coming soon.

[Richard OFfill]

Carl, I believe it will get more pronounced. You have heard the old saying that anything goes. Well the truth is that in the area of faith and morals anything won't go.

 I can't grow certain flowers in my flowerbeds because nematodes get into the roots. I am afraid that in some places the spiritual roots have nematodes.

Having said that, there is a revival of holiness on the part of many. The banquet will be full!

[Raven]

An Adventist school paying tribute to jazz?!  How low can we go?  I don't see how rock or jazz can be manipulated (in one's mind) to be compatible with Christian principles.  Both kinds of music are decadent.

In the interests of full disclosure, I grew up in the 50's and 60's, with Elvis, the Beatles, etc.  I listened to the garbage as a teen and beyond.  Can't stand it now, and much of it was "benign" compared to what passes for music today.  Never did like jazz.  Even as a teen I understood that rock and jazz did not belong in church.

I've noticed an interesting phenomenon with music over the years.  I have a satellite radio.  There are stations for every kind of music, including stations that play music exclusively from the 40's, 50's, 60's, and so on, until the 90's I think.  If you scroll through the stations you see that, while much of the music, even from the 40's was incompatible with Christianity, it got progressively worse.  Up until the 70's the music often had catchy tunes, and the words could be understood for the most part.  Starting in the late 70's or early 80's it started to become less melodious, noisier, and frequently the words cannot be understood--and the quality of the singing voices declined.  Much of what passes for music today sounds more like noise accompanied by screeching.  Am I just an old geezer out of touch, or have I pegged it about right?  And don't get me started on "rap."  That's not music.

[Carl]

Am I just an old geezer out of touch, or have I pegged it about right?  And don't get me started on "rap."  That's not music.

No Raven, not a old geezer,  just part of a group on one side of the like minded. The other group is the "New Adventists" The division (and the shaking) is fast forming. Even today, I find it harder and harder to talk to the progressives, their ideas are so "in the know" the ones who say people like Ellen White are so, you know, out of date.

[jenkins]

To some I might be old but I just turned four score years old so I am younger than some on here. When I see such things i am actually appalled and saddened by such frivolous use of time. This is one thing I cannot tolerate to much and thankfully the majority of my church fill the same. Call us conservative I don't care but I say no christian should wast time on secular music or it's imitations. 

Maybe I should share a little background that might shed a little perspective on this subject. I was raised up in a Adventist home, went to a Adventist school and was baptized into the Adventist church but yet was never really converted. And you probably could piece in the rest of the story. at age 18 I went and did my own thing. parties drugs and alcohol were what I began to live for and oh yes the worlds music. I never paid much attention to the lyrics but only to the sound and the beat. I have to admit I was a heavy metal head banger, a disco junky, and even a country music guru.

But then I found Jesus and my world changed. I started to find that these things that I once love I began to hate, but we know this is how the Holy Spirit works. The music I once loved the Holy Spirit convicted me that it was wrong to listen to it but yet He filled the void with some great old fashioned hymns. So I have lived in both worlds. I have been led by demonic forces and as well the forces of God. and when I see music that sounds no different then when I was controlled by satanic forces infiltrating the church, by all means I will appose and condemn it.

My question would be. are such people that do such stuff or listen to such things really converted? I believe God allows us to be fruit inspectors so do such things reflect the character of God? I will let you come to your own conclusions.     

[Larry Lyons]

Has anyone seen the lectures by Frank Garlock that have been presented on Amazing Discoveries? Garlock is a musician and has directed church Choirs and taught music for many years. I believe he said he was at one time a student of Robert Shaw. (Of the famous Robert Shaw Chorale). Garlock says what is wrong with using worldly music in church and explains in depth the nature of music, its effect on our brains and our spirituality. They have been repeating the lectures. They are well worth watching. If our church leaders had this information a few decades ago they might have been able to give an educated answer to at least impede the baby boomers and the leaders who brought in worldly music back in the 60s and 70s. It saddens me that there are no Adventists who are doing what Garlock is doing. Actually, I'm not sure, but I think these lectures were recorded possibly at least a few years ago. He is pretty old. He published a very good book on the subject in 1992 titled Music in the Balance.

[Larry Lyons]

I recall that Pastor O'Ffill with a couple of other pastors and a music director of a large church did weekend seminars on music in the church several years ago. As far as I know, nobody else has done that. It is needed now more than ever.

[Carl]

John Lomacang speaks a lot about music. I can't post a link so here's the description, cut & paste this link into any search engine:

3angelstube, John Lomacang, three unclean spirits, the revealing.

[lotrob]

Has anyone seen the lectures by Frank Garlock that have been presented on Amazing Discoveries? Garlock is a musician and has directed church Choirs and taught music for many years. I believe he said he was at one time a student of Robert Shaw. (Of the famous Robert Shaw Chorale). Garlock says what is wrong with using worldly music in church and explains in depth the nature of music, its effect on our brains and our spirituality. They have been repeating the lectures. They are well worth watching. If our church leaders had this information a few decades ago they might have been able to give an educated answer to at least impede the baby boomers and the leaders who brought in worldly music back in the 60s and 70s. It saddens me that there are no Adventists who are doing what Garlock is doing. Actually, I'm not sure, but I think these lectures were recorded possibly at least a few years ago. He is pretty old. He published a very good book on the subject in 1992 titled Music in the Balance.

Christian Berdahl has recently completed a series on music.  Like Neumann, he use to be in the worldly music, performing arts business but he turned . . . see a preview here and the availability of his 5 set DVD  at his wesite by his ministry's name shepherdscall . . .

[V. Hahn]

Christian Berdahl has recently completed a series on music.  Like Neumann, he use to be in the worldly music, performing arts business but he turned . . . see a preview here and the availability of his 5 set DVD  at his wesite by his ministry's name shepherdscall . . .

Good to see you, Lotrob!  Thanks for the info.

[lotrob]

Good to see you, Lotrob!  Thanks for the info.

Thanks Sis Vicki, this is Sister Lottie.  Don't get to this site much.

[adventmom2_4]

Ivor Myers does seminars on music. His background is in rap music.  He has a sermon entitled Sonic Warfare that you can get.  We just went and heard Karl Tsatalbasidis speak in person the last weekend in April. He was a professional rock and jazz drummer.  The head of the music committee at our church showed his series on DVD about a year ago.  Christian Berdahl is another good one who has a background in the entertainment industry.  The resources are out there if people want to seek the truth about music and how it affects us.  Most everyone I know who does these types of seminars came out of the entertainment industry into the church.  Let's see, Wolfgang Steffani is an Adventist professor who does knowledgeable seminars on music too.

[Larry Lyons]

Those all sound like good resources. Thank you.